(no subject)

[constance_b]

Seen quite a few entries on my flist the last couple of weeks about a kerfuffle, which is just a lovely word. I'm not really in the loop fandom gossip wise and I haven't had the online time to follow links and find the sources of the kerfuffles (look, it plurals) and I certainly don't want to get involved in other people's disagreements but I have a thing or too to say about reviews. I'll put it behind a cut because I'm kinda opinionated for a newbie.



The word, to me, means something critical. A book or film review in a paper for instance will mention the good and bad in the piece and generally say whether or not, in the opinion of the reviewer, they are worse reading/watching. A review is a useful thing, a guide for the potential audience. Now I get that feedback is a slightly different case, the only payment an author receives &tc, but surely it should be something more than payment. If people don't feel free to give an honest opinion then how are you supposed to judge how well you've done with your fic? Okay, so some people are so frustratingly stupid you want to beat their brains out with a hammer, by which I mean the people who read fics on Spuffy only sites and then leave reviews saying they don't like Spuffy. And okay, some people are nasty which makes you want to be nasty right back, but that's life. When the spotty boy down the road from me calls me an ugly cow I don't go home and start cutting on myself, I think he's an obnoxious twat. If you put your fic, or your anything, in the public domain you have to be prepared to take it, the alternative is hiding in a box.

That isn't to say I think people shouldn't disagree with, or even rant against, a review but how it gets from an argument to a kerfuffle is beyond me. I don't really understand how someone can be really upset by a bad review, unless it's from someone they admire. And even then, someone taking the time to comment on your fic is a compliment all of itself. I'm too lazy to leave bad reviews, if I don't like a fic I stop reading, as a writer I'm grateful to the people who bothered to correct my American or offer advice and flattered that some people liked my fic enough to keep reading despite the annoyances. If I have a comment from someone who enjoyed my fic then I sit and wriggle with happiness, which is all well and good but achieves nothing. If I have a comment telling me how I could have done better then I go away and (try to) write something better. I've learnt stuff. But still I'd like to know the opinions of the people who didn't like it enough to comment. Maybe other people feel differently but again, how do you get from feeling differently to kerfuffle? And how on earth can you get from any one comment to half of fandom being up in arms?

Opps, did I just insult half of fandom? Lucky my LJ doesn't have a big enough audience for me to cause a kerfuffle of my own. I hate Americans, by the way, and religious people and nonsmokers and cat lovers and anyone who thinks babies are cute. I'm kidding, honestly, I love my fandom. And LJ. People are kind and helpful and supportive and friendly so why give a piss about the ones who aren't. It would be a terrible thing if the internet was a place you had to be afraid to say what you think and it would deny those of us that want to learn to write an invaluable resource.


So I want to make it clear: I love concrit. I also love flat out criticism, opinions that I don't share, opinions that I violently disagree with, arguing, sniping, insults, lurkers, swear words and whispered endearments. And Spuffy. I don't hold to the 'if you have nothing nice to say, keep your mouth shut' adage. ALL comments are welcome on this LJ. If you don't like my fic, say so, please, if you can spare the time to say why even better. Disagree with me, dislike me, I take offence at nothing and it makes the compliments all the sweeter when people feel free to really speak their mind.

Comments

[alwaysjbj.livejournal.com]

I think I love you!

[constance-b.livejournal.com]

Really? Me? You don't happen to be a lean and muscular man with a twelve inch penis and a cuddly side do you? If so, I can be single at a moments notice.

[superplin.livejournal.com]

Hee. Well, the kerfuffle was about something that happened at a conference/convention, so not on the Internet, and not about fanfic feedback. I'll spare you the unpleasant details.

In any case, your point about feedback is well taken. However, there are also people who don't comment not because they didn't like a story, but because they feel they have nothing more to add over what others have already said, out of shyness, laziness, etc. And frequently people aren't reading in a particularly critical state of mind, in the sense that they're just there to enjoy the ride, and not specifically looking for problems. Which means that their primary response frequently is just, "Wow, that was fun! When do we get more?"

[constance-b.livejournal.com]

I'm usually one of those people, most often the lazy one, I was in no way throwing stones at people who don't comment, or don't have much to say when they do.

[gillo]

I agree, mostly. The trouble is,some people are very vulnerable and write for a variety of reasons to do with exorcising their own demons. And concrit can feel very damaging to people who are so fragile. That doesn't make what they write any less valuable - indeed, some outstanding writers I know probably fit into that category. But it does mean they can be hurt by what was never intended to give hurt. I think it's wise to suss out whether or not actual crit is welcome, frankly.

For myself, I'm in two minds. Comments are a joy and an addiction in any form, but undoubtedly the detailed comments which show a piece has been read thoroughly and thoughtfully are worth far more. However, that sometimes means pointing out bits that don't work. And sometimes that can hurt. I crit kids' writing professionally all the time. (OK, in the trade we call it "marking", but it's the same thing. Just as, oddly, we discuss first drafts rather than doing a beta job. Weird.) I'm aware that you have to be very careful how you put negative things, and that's even more true over such a restricted medium as LJ, where we cannot see facial expressions, hear tone of voice or, often,gauge level of intensity of criticism. Personally I'd rather have real comments, as just "Good" leaves me wondering if a reader is being kind and can't find anything constructive to say about a meh piece. But that may just be my paranoia.

You come across as confident in your own work, which is great - but some people, even quite superb writers, don't have that confidence. Don't knock 'em for it. (And, no, I'm not suggesting you were knocking anyone.) The harshest concrit should come from a beta - mine sometimes depresses me terribly, but it's very good for me. In a journal comment, visible to all, perhaps restraint is a good idea.

Shutting up now. [/rant]

[boschette.livejournal.com]

You nailed it. Thank you. Unfortunately, I probably fit into the fragile-ish category. Not that I don't appreciate anyone who would take the time and effort to offer concrit, because I do. Maybe it's more accurate for me to say my muse is fragile, and when it's brought to my attention (either through a review or through my own realization) that something in a particular story isn't working, the whole story can unravel like a cheap sweater. It's less about being thin-skinned than it is about the creative process. I write (and read) fanfic because I enjoy it. It's an escape, it's wish-fulfillment, it's a much more satisfying pastime than watching sitcom reruns on TV when I've nothing better to do. And I post what I write, not for praise—heartfelt or otherwise—or for crit, but because I figure that if I enjoyed writing it, someone somewhere will enjoy reading it. If they don't, that's fine, and we can all go about our merry way. And I'll still have the confidence to try again, and maybe next time I'll make that connection.

Um ... am I making sense? It's early, and I haven't had coffee yet. Anyway, great post. (See, you can't even escape the compliments in a non-fic entry.) ;)

[gillo]

Yes, you make sense - and much more than I ever achieve pre-coffee, too.

I get incredibly tense about my own writing when I post some. I do manips or icons, and if people like them, great, if they don't, who cares. But my entire life has been built on reading and writing, and it matters far more to me than it should - so that criticism can make me feel I'm making too big a mess of it to be worth risking trying again. And taht probably applies even more when I see the justice of it!

Thanks for the compliment. I have begun to learn to accept those. ;-)

[constance-b.livejournal.com]

I don't know if it's just about confidence in my writing. Just knowing that everything can be improved and nothing appeals to everyone. I love writing, and if other people enjoy reading that's hugely good, but it wouldn't end my life if I suddenly realised every word I'd written was crap. And certainly I agree it's wise to find out what people want, but it is hard to be wise with every hastily dashed out comment and like you say things can be read differently to how they sounded in your head.
To be honest I don't really understand how anyone can be so lacking in confidence that they can't brush off even a really negative comment. This is mostly likely a flaw in my unsympathetic and unempathic personality. And sometimes not mentioning for instance a plot hole in an otherwise good fic feels like letting someone walk around with their flies undone because you don't want to embarrass them by saying anything.
Not that it applies to your work, because your Spike characterization is so good if you were to pick up any flaws I doubt I'd notice.

[gillo]

To be honest I don't really understand how anyone can be so lacking in confidence that they can't brush off even a really negative comment.

Some people are very vulnerable - and in my experience quite a high proportion of people who interact on the Net, whether here on lj or on verious boards and even some corners of Usenet are actually more fragile than the norm - they use this means of communication to some extent because it is less threatening than sharing ideas and writing in RL.

This is mostly likely a flaw in my unsympathetic and unempathic personality.

Hee. I doubt it - but I've spent enough time on the Net and enough time working with fragile adolescents to recognises certain marked similarities. (I am not saying that these writers are immature, just that I recognise the same mix of slight brashness and vulnerability.) Quie a few people seem to look to corners of the Net like ours for emotional support and take it more to heart than one might expect when things go a little pear-shaped.

Not that it applies to your work, because your Spike characterization is so good if you were to pick up any flaws I doubt I'd notice.

::blushes::

I really wasn't fishing for compliments, but thank you. I often feel my writing is rather staid and worthy but uninspired.

[skybound2]

anyone who thinks babies are cute.

*Giggle, snort*

I have to echo alwaysjbj right now. I think I love you :-)

I'm not a kerfuffley person myself. Half the time I'll read through them simply because I'm a biologist at heart, with sociologist tendencies, and those things are better then most controlled experiments.